Comments on: Student Syndrome http://blog.franktrindade.com/2008/07/27/student-syndrome/ Agile, software and some non-sense Thu, 17 Jun 2010 09:41:19 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.0 By: Francisco Trindade http://blog.franktrindade.com/2008/07/27/student-syndrome/comment-page-1/#comment-40 Francisco Trindade Thu, 07 Aug 2008 20:05:40 +0000 http://franktrindade.wordpress.com/?p=50#comment-40 In that case, we agree : ) Cheers In that case, we agree : )

Cheers

]]> By: Chris Leishman http://blog.franktrindade.com/2008/07/27/student-syndrome/comment-page-1/#comment-39 Chris Leishman Thu, 07 Aug 2008 00:31:08 +0000 http://franktrindade.wordpress.com/?p=50#comment-39 Absolutely true. I never advocate getting rid of iterations - just not batching work into them. Of course, you can simply record the times that goal units (story points) reach the end of the process, and then use that data to calculate throughput over any time period you like depending on what you want to look at. Obviously we must take care to remember that as the time period gets smaller, the statistical variation in throughput will get larger. Even then, however, iterations are good because they give you a time frame in which to schedule feedback - feedback to the business in the form of a showcase and feedback from the team in the form of a retrospective or other improvement exercise. Absolutely true. I never advocate getting rid of iterations – just not batching work into them. Of course, you can simply record the times that goal units (story points) reach the end of the process, and then use that data to calculate throughput over any time period you like depending on what you want to look at. Obviously we must take care to remember that as the time period gets smaller, the statistical variation in throughput will get larger.

Even then, however, iterations are good because they give you a time frame in which to schedule feedback – feedback to the business in the form of a showcase and feedback from the team in the form of a retrospective or other improvement exercise.

]]> By: Francisco Trindade http://blog.franktrindade.com/2008/07/27/student-syndrome/comment-page-1/#comment-38 Francisco Trindade Tue, 05 Aug 2008 08:58:18 +0000 http://franktrindade.wordpress.com/?p=50#comment-38 @Chris Thanks for your comment. I totally agree with you, but I think that one important point you mentioned is the idea of throughput. And if you're going to measure throughput somehow, you have to use some kind of "iteration" for that, since you need a time measure for it. Cheers @Chris

Thanks for your comment. I totally agree with you, but I think that one important point you mentioned is the idea of throughput.

And if you’re going to measure throughput somehow, you have to use some kind of “iteration” for that, since you need a time measure for it.

Cheers

]]> By: Chris Leishman http://blog.franktrindade.com/2008/07/27/student-syndrome/comment-page-1/#comment-37 Chris Leishman Tue, 05 Aug 2008 05:43:16 +0000 http://franktrindade.wordpress.com/?p=50#comment-37 The student syndrome is actually one of my arguments against the typical XP/Scrum practice of batching stories into iterations - eg. doing an iteration planning meeting to decide what will be worked on in the next iteration. Some argue that it creates a sense of commitment and motivation - I argue that the student syndrome will apply and the work will possibly be delayed until the last minute. Hence I'm much more in favour of having a continuous flow of stories pulled through a delivery pipeline, where the incentive is to simply continuously improve the throughput. The student syndrome is actually one of my arguments against the typical XP/Scrum practice of batching stories into iterations – eg. doing an iteration planning meeting to decide what will be worked on in the next iteration. Some argue that it creates a sense of commitment and motivation – I argue that the student syndrome will apply and the work will possibly be delayed until the last minute.

Hence I’m much more in favour of having a continuous flow of stories pulled through a delivery pipeline, where the incentive is to simply continuously improve the throughput.

]]> By: Francisco Trindade http://blog.franktrindade.com/2008/07/27/student-syndrome/comment-page-1/#comment-35 Francisco Trindade Tue, 29 Jul 2008 12:45:57 +0000 http://franktrindade.wordpress.com/?p=50#comment-35 @Dave I can understand your point and agree that programmers with no estimates can be more productive, but I'd like to see more information about which were their motivations, and how they were being "evaluated". What comes to my mind is that a productivity study, when people know they are going to be measured by their productivity, is different than a real project, which has many other issues. And even if I agree with this scenario, most projects have iterations, and that by itself is a deadline, which can lead to the problem I described in the post. Cheers @Dave

I can understand your point and agree that programmers with no estimates can be more productive, but I’d like to see more information about which were their motivations, and how they were being “evaluated”. What comes to my mind is that a productivity study, when people know they are going to be measured by their productivity, is different than a real project, which has many other issues.

And even if I agree with this scenario, most projects have iterations, and that by itself is a deadline, which can lead to the problem I described in the post.

Cheers

]]> By: Dave Kirby http://blog.franktrindade.com/2008/07/27/student-syndrome/comment-page-1/#comment-36 Dave Kirby Tue, 29 Jul 2008 11:55:35 +0000 http://franktrindade.wordpress.com/?p=50#comment-36 There was a study reported in the book Peopleware that compared projects by who did the estimating. Programmers who were allowed to do their own estimates were shown to be more productive than programmers who had an estimate imposed by a manager. Programmers who had the estimates done by a neutral outside expert were even more productive. The most surprising result was that programmers on projects with NO estimates were most productive of all, and by a significant margin. I suspect that if you do not have a deadline (either imposed externally or by yourself) then the student syndrome does not kick in at all - you can't leave things to the last minute since there is no last minute. There was a study reported in the book Peopleware that compared projects by who did the estimating. Programmers who were allowed to do their own estimates were shown to be more productive than programmers who had an estimate imposed by a manager. Programmers who had the estimates done by a neutral outside expert were even more productive.

The most surprising result was that programmers on projects with NO estimates were most productive of all, and by a significant margin. I suspect that if you do not have a deadline (either imposed externally or by yourself) then the student syndrome does not kick in at all – you can’t leave things to the last minute since there is no last minute.

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